HOLY TO A WHOLE PEOPLE

Alexander Norman meets the Dalai Lama,

who will be cold-shouldered by the Government here next week

New Delhi THE prospect of spending 40 minutes in the company of an incarnate deity arouses mixed expectations. On the one hand, there is the secret hope of instant beatifica- tion. On the other, there is a fear of disillusionment, of being let down in some way. So it was some misgiVing that I was shown into the presence of Tenzin Gyatso, 14th Dalai Lama and 53rd earthly mani- festation of Chenrezig, Buddha of Com- passion.

His Holiness (born 53 years ago plain Lhamo Dhondup, the son of a peasant fatmer) is taller, more heavily built than expected. There is something unexpected in his demeanour too — he had not the overt physical charisma one expects, rather a warmth that seems somehow to fill the whole room — which is transmitted through a firm, lingering hand-grasp (one could not call it a handshake). He wears the same maroon robes with saffron waist- coat as any other monk and, for footwear, plain, thickly soled brown shoes which lend a workmanlike air to his appearance that his blue-tinted spectacles do nothing to undermine. His hair is cropped to a sha- dow like all the other monks. Yet in spite of this apparent ordinariness, there is something in his bearing that invites rever- ence: he looks holy — rather in the way that the Queen, even in her scruffiest riding habit, manages always to look royal. It did not seem appropriate to ask whether it is true that, like our own Minister of Environment, His Holiness has a passion for gardening. Politics looked a better bet: 'With regard to the recent disturbances in Lhasa, what role do you see for yourself at this time?'

The Dalai Lama paused, which he does frequently, cogitating. He coughed (he had a cold) before replying in English which, though accurate is staccato and heavily accented, sounding more Far Eastern than Indian. Frequently, he corrected himself, sometimes lapsing into Tibetan, which was then translated by his secretary who would invariably begin 'His Holiness said . . Occasionally, the secretary would become stuck over a word, in which case His Holiness corrected him, as if he had merely been wanting a moment's rest. 'It's difficult to say. You see, I have always regarded myself as a sort of free spokesman for the Tibetan people, with those people inside Tibet as my boss, so to speak. But right now, they — irrespective of whether they are believers or not — have such confi- dence, such faith in me as Dalai Lama that I find myself almost over-burdened with responsibility. Of course, the reality of the present situation is that things are not at all easy and people are expecting too much. They trust me too much. So whilst in the past I feel that I was able to contribute something to Tibet as a nation, to Tibetan culture, to Buddhism — for the future I don't know.' Then he laughed. It was a child's laugh, high-pitched and shaking his whole frame. As he did so, his short, broad eyebrows shot up and he looked like a sort of earthy cherub. Clearly, he knew perfect- ly well.

'Do you therefore consider yourself to be more of a religious than a temporal leader?'

'Oh definitely. Definitely religious. I always consider myself, first and foremost, to be a monk. A Buddhist monk. Dalai Lama comes after that. In my daily life, I can say that 80 to 90 per cent of my energy is expended on religious matters, the re- maining ten to 20 per cent on Tibetan problems. So naturally, I feel myself pri- marily to be a religious person. Besides, I have studied religion, I have some experi- ence of religion, so I have some confidence in that respect. But politics are a different matter. You see, I have no modern educa- tion, nothing of that nature. And although perhaps I have learned something over the past 40 years, I don't feel well equipped for someone who is supposed to carry respon- sibilities. For me, politics is not voluntary work. Rather, I am compelled to do it because of people's hope and trust'.

'So, as a religious leader, presumably you cannot foresee a time when you would condone violence?'

'I don't think so, no. Never. What happened recently in Tibet was an under- standable expression of people's despera- tion. But whilst naturally I admire their determination, I cannot condone their

behaviour because firstly, as a Buddhist monk, I hold that violence is not good. Secondly, I am a firm believer in the Gandhian ethic of passive resistance. And thirdly, in reality, violence is not our strength. OUr strength is truth, justice, reason and human understanding. If we Tibetans utilise this strength, we have a basis for talking with the Chinese and we can perietrate the Chinese mind — if not in this generation, then in the next. But if we use violence, we can very easily be crushed. So there's no point anyway in supporting violence.'

As he speaks, the Dalai Lama sways back and forth, a reflex common to monks as they chant. Mostly, his voice is pitched low, but sometimes it rises (usually when he speaks personally), showing great range. Often, it is accompanied by gestures which reveal the deeply engraved palms of his clean, though by no means delicate, hands — as well as a plain watch and a rosary both worn on the left wrist.

`With regard to your forthcoming visit to Britain, are you disappointed to be forbid- den to speak on political issues?'

`No. Actually not. My visit is purely for religious teaching. It's not of a politician nature. Besides; there's not much to say, not much to discuss at the moment. There was some good publicity for our cause when the people of Tibet — my boss — spoke early this month. So for me as free spokesman, there's not much to do. And also, I do not want to create any unneces- sary embarrassment for the government concerned.'

'But nevertheless, do you consider that Britain has a role to play?'

Oh yes, of course. I think so. As every Tibetan who knows anything about history knows, Britain is the only country outside Tibet With whom we have ever had direct links. Britain is the only country who knows the real situation. So there is a very close link. Also, I think that Britain has at the moment very good relations with Chi- na, so there is a role for Britain to play. Furthermore, I have a great admiration for Mrs Thatcher. Her attitude towards Russia is very correct, I feel: criticising whilst at the same time trying to improve human understanding, as .a good friend. What I am not so certain about is Britain's attitude towards China. At the moment, there is only praise, trying to please, not daring to criticise. If I were Chinese, then I think I would begin to wonder whether Britain is being completely sincere. But this is not my business.'

I wondered whether he believed that religion itself has a role in politics? `Yes. A very important one. But we must make a clear distinction between religious institutions and the practice of religion. Religious institutions and politics should stay apart.. However, I believe that politics become dirty because politicians become dirty, even though politics them- selves are an instrument to help solve problems in society. The honesty, sincerity and moral principles of religion make for clean politics. If these spiritual qualities are lacking in politicians, their politics become dirty. So in that way, I feel that religion has a place in politics.'

`What is your reaction to the Chinese response to the demonstrations in Tibet?'

`It's very sad. Of course, the Chinese themselves have lost a great deal. As I said recently, what the Chinese have done in Tibet is a mutual misery!' Again laughter. For an instant, he was a boy monk, playing and joking during a too serious ceremony.

`Have you had any contact with the Chinese since the .demonstrations began?'

'Oh yes. The Chinese want to keep the dialogue open, despite what has happened and despite what they say about me. The other day, the retiring President, whom I've known for 34 years, made a speech saying that China respects the Dalai Lama but that I don't respect China! But of course, the real question is not whether the Chinese respect the Dalai Lama, but whether they respect the entire Tibetan people. If they did, then there would be no problem.' `Do you believe then that Buddhism can in some way accommodate Communist ideology?'

'I think so. If both Buddhists and Com- munists accept reality, then there is com- mon ground. Certainly one of the attrac- tions of communism for me is its concept of wealth distribution to all people. That's a very moral ethic. Unfortunately however, it seems that since 1917, communism has been deflected from its moral foundations by people motivated not so much by compassion for humanity as by hatred of certain sections of it, together with a general want of human sympathy and respect for others. So clearly there is something lacking in communism — some- thing that Buddhism can fill very easily, I believe.'

`And are there any grounds for optimism in this respect?'

`Oh yes. Things are improving, compa- ratively speaking. The Chinese today are much more open-minded than formerly. They have a much more human face, more human feeling. That's the positive side and that is the basis of our hope.'

`With reference to yourself, you are considered to be the reincarnation of all previous Dalai Lamas. At the same time, you are believed to be a reincarnation of the Buddha Chenrezig. This tenet is almost impossible for a Christian to comprehend.' 'Well, first of all, Buddhists accept the theory of rebirth for all sentient beings. And within that, we believe that there exist people who choose to come back — which they can do any number of times, even simultaneously. This we call reincarnation. In my own case, there are clear indications that these beings, the Dalai Lamas are, you might say, specially blessed by Chenrezig. Therefore we regard them as being rein- carnations of Chenrezig. Now this, does not mean that all Dalai Lamas are a continua- tion of a single consciousness. You see, there are a lot of people who have received the blessing of Chenrezig. `Chenrezig' it- self means 'a manifestation of Buddha's mercy'. Such a manifestation of Buddha's mercy, Buddha's compassion, does not constitute a unique identity of being. So it can be said that any person who haS an extraordinary amount of compassion has received the blessing of Chenrezig. Now my own case, I may say that I feel that I am indeed one of those people who have received some special blessing frotn Chen- rezig, as with all previous Dalai Lamas. But as to my own previous lives — I don't know. It's difficult to say.'

'And are, you confident that the institu- tion of Dalai Lama will continue?' (His Holiness was still laughing.) 'I don't know. I'm not much bothered about that. I'm not much concerned. In fact, as early as 1963, I made a draft of a future Tibetan constitution in which I made quite clear that the institution of Dalai Lama could be removed by a two thirds majority vote in the National Assembly. Then, in 1969, I affirmed offi- cially that the institution should be entirely accountable to the wishes of the people. If future circumstances show no need, that there is no further use for the Dalai Lama institution, then it will cease. It will remain only so long as the Tibetan people wish. If they do, then they will find another when I pass away.'

'But for now, you don't consider it to be an important issue?'

'Not at all. You see, at the moment, the Dalai Lama is almost a symbol for Tibet. But, that's at the moment. Now Tibetan BuddhisM existed before the Dalai Lama institution came into being and most prob- ably, it will remain in the future, like Tibet itself. But the institution of Dalai LaMa may not.'

I wondered, by way of a last question, whether the Dalai Lama had any ambi- tions.

'As a monk — indeed, as a human being, I believe that one's life should be utilised meaningfully. Now listen to me. The pur- pose of thiS life is every moment to serve other people, to try to help others. And if circumstances don't permit, then at least one should refrain from harming other peOple. So yOu may say that is my ambi- tion. You see, all human beings are basi- cally the same. They, all want happiness. No one wants suffering. There's no very complicated philosophy involved.'

It would be iniquitous, were it not merely ludicrous, that the British Govern- ment will not welcome the Dalai Lama When he arrives in London next week, that Mrs Thatcher receives deputations from the murderous Palestinian Liberation Organisation, but will not receive this man of peace. But if the Prime Minister cannot, might not the Prince of Wales?