Debates anb Wroceebinas n Varliatnent.

THE OPIUM WAR.

The debate on Sir JAMES GRAHAM'S motion on the conduct of Go- vernment in relation to the affairs of China, commenced in the House of Commons on Tuesday. Sir JAMES delivered a very long and elabo- rate speech to substantiate the following charges against the Ministers. They had neglected to alter that part of the original Order in Council, and of the instructions to Lord Napier, which directed the Superin- tendent to reside at Canton, after experience had proved the inexpe- diency of attempting to carry out that direction. They had omitted to correct another error in the instruction, by which the Superintendent was ordered to communicate directly with the Chinese authorities, and on equal terms—not as a petitioner. Although the presence of a naval force off the coast of China was most desirable, and recommended in a memorandum left by the Duke of Wellington when he quitted office in 1835, no such force had been placed at the disposal of the Superin- tendent till 1839. They had not supplied Captain Elliot with power to suppress the illicit trade in opium ; and throughout the whole of the difficult circumstances in which he was placed, had neglected to furnish him with instructions. For these omissions, Ministers merited the censure of Parliament. Sir James supported his allegations by quotations from the China papers laid before Parliament ; calling particular attention to the meagre despatches which, at long intervals, Lord Palmerston vouchsafed in reply to Captain Elliot's pressing re- presentations of the difficulties which surrounded him, and of the serious consequences likely to arise from perseverance in the opium-trade, and the growing jealousy of the Chinese authorities. Ile showed by a minute examination of dates, that important letters remained for months unanswered ; that applications front the Superintendents for advice and increase of authority were disregarded ; that the state of affairs in China became gradually worse ; that Lord Palmerston in par- tieular was kept fully informed on these points but did nothing. These questions of detail were elaborately worked out, but the most effective passages in Sir James's speech had reference to the general policy of a war with China, Ile thus described the value of the China trade to this country and to India- " I am guilty of no exaggeration when I state, that one-sixth of the whole united revenue of Great Britain and India is dependent on our commercial re- lations with China. In the lust year, the revenue paid into the Exchequer on account of tea in this country amounted to no less a sum than 3,660,000f. ; besides that, there are several receipts arising from imposts upon other im- ports from that country ; making the British revenue derived from her inter- comet with China no less a sum annually than 4,200,1100/. Now with respect to India, where our difficulties are principally financial, I would beg to call the attention of the House to how large a proportion of the revenue of that country is remitted from China. The gross income of India may be stated at 20,000,000/. annually ; and, unless I am mistaken, the income derived from China is no lets than 2,000,000/. annually ; und the difficulty of our connexion with India king the difficulty of remittance, China has afforded this remark- able facility in its intercourse with India, that year by year for the last five years aince the trade was opened, there has been an annual influx from China into India of epecie averaging 1,300,000/. annually, and in the last year yield- ing no less a sum than 1,700,000/. I have already, I think, related enough to the House to its attention to this subject as a most important one, con- idering that at the present moment, whether at home or in India, our difficul- ;ice are principally financial."

The power and resources of the people with whom England is about

to engage in war-

•

The Chinese empire is inhabited by three hundred and fifty millions of human beings, ail directed by the will of one man, all speaking one language, all governed by one rode °flaws, all professing one religion, and all actuated by the same of national pride and prejudice. They date their origin net by centuries, la! it by tens of centuries, transmitted to them in regular suc- cession, -under it p:,triarehal government, without interruption ; and boast of education, of printIng, of civilization, darts, and of all the conveniences and many of the luviri, :of life, as enjoyed by them when Europe was still sunk in barbarism, and o the light of knowledge was obscured in this our Western hemisphere. DM vot only to their numbers—not only with regard to that unity which is sireagth, I also call the attention of the House to their immense wealth. They possess an annual revenue of 60,000,000/. regularly collected ; they have no dent ; they inhabit the largest and fairest portion of Asia; in nearly one-third 01' that which is in the finest climate, they cultivate a most fruitful soil, Nt h la is watered by the finest rivers, and intersected by a canal 1,200 miles in which is one of the standing wonders of the world : and in every portion of this immense empire there is one uniformity of system— one jealous suspieion of strangers, evinced both on the shores of the Yellow Sea and along the confines of India, and the boundaries of AVa, Tibet, and Nepali]. Surely, then, I may ask the question' at the outset of this debate, whether it is not wiser to trade than to quarrel with such a nation as this? Would it not he more prudent to conciliate such a people by the arts of peace, than vex them with the threats and cruelties of war ?"

Reasons for Chinese jealousy of England- ', They have ouly to look across the Himalaya, and they see Hindostan pros-

trate at the feet of Great Britain. They are not so ignorant as not to be per- fectly aware of the policy that led to this conquest. Hardly a century is past since oar empire, hy small beginnings, arose : and how did. it arise ? It arose under the pretenee of trade and the semblance of commerce. Scarcely a century Las elapsed she... oar first factory was established in that country. We began by building a vttrehouse—we surrounded it with walls—we added a ditch—we armed our level:men—we increased the number of Europeans; we formed a garrison ; we treated with the native powers—we soon discovered their weak- ness ; the garrisou marched out—Arcot was seized—the battle of Plassy was won; what C five commenced the Wellesloys concluded; Seringapatiun was taken, the :Mysore was vanquished, the Muhratta war was terminated by the battle of Assii:. e„ and India became ours. Nor is this all—the Indus and the Ganges no loi, r bound the limits of our empire; the Hydaspes has been passed, Cahill and Caudahar have witues..ed the advance of our armies, Central Asia trembles at our presence and almost acknowledges our dominion : and on the borders of tttieh an empire, is it not natural that the Chinese, seeing what has passed, sholdl feel the utmost jealousy at the settlement of any of the British within ir territories? Their whole policy is fixed upon two cardinal points—the xi dim of strangers from residence as of right within their ter- ritories, and from direct communication with the viceregal authority."

Sir James's pc roration-

Ile might be d%ceived, but he was himself persuaded that this was no little war, that could le conducted with a peace establishment, or that could be ter- minated in a day ; he conceived that it would be a war Ito less formidable than the marmitude of the interests at stake. If this war were really to take place, it must be rvoll,eted that it was to be carried on at the most remote part of the habitable globe; at a part where the monsoon must constantly interrupt the communication.; between the force and those employed to direct it; at a part very far from our own ports and arsenals, in a district accessible only after a long voya.„:. ; it was a war to be carried on by troops disembarked from crowded transpai k, who must fight under a burning sun, in a service for which they would have little enthusiasm. If be could be persuaded that after all our negotiations this 0as an inevitable evil—if he could believe that her Majesty's Government, ii if 1: that due caution and foresight which this country had a right to expect, Ltd used every means to avert the evil—if he could believe that we were cib I upon to enter into this IV not only to punish those who slighted us, but la the necessary defence of our national honour—he was per- suaded that the it hole martial spirit of the country would gird itself up for the conflict, and meta the danger without fear or anxiety. But on the contrary, when they saw on the part f her Majesty's advisers the most pertinacious adherence to the erroneous conc.,. repudiated both by experience and reason—when they saw that they at to three on almond and powerful people a mode of proceed- ing to which the ii eake8I would not tamely submit—when they saw that the ad- vice of one oft In i ;attest and most prudent of our statesmen, who himself had warned them, was disregarded and rejected—when they saw repeated warnings given by the svrva ate of the same Administration equally unattended to.—

when they saw branch of the trade which the confidential servants of the

Administration declared to be piratical, not put down by the interference of her Majest■ . overnment—when they saw nothing done or attempted to be done, whil..t c Majesty's Superintendent was left without power, without ile,truction, and without force to meet the emergency which must have been naturally expected to follow—he could not help asking the House, whether they did believe that the people of this country would patiently submit to the burden which tbk Parliament must of necessity impose, and whether that people could repa,... rontidence in an Administration that, by a mismanage- ment of five vi..-, had destroyed a trade which had flourished for centuries, and which, in ion to the loss which the country had already undergone, had .almost Phd ii it into a war in which success would not be attended with glory, and i a which defeat would be our ruin and our shame.

Sir James concluded with moving the following resolution-

" That it apvirs to this House, on consideration of the papers relating to China, presented to this House by command of her Majesty, that the inter- ruption in our commercial and friendly intercourse with that country, and the hostilities whirl, have since taken place, are mainly to be attributed to the want of foresight ;mil precaution on the part of her Majesty's present advisers, iu respect to our relations with China, and especially to their neglect to fur- nish the Superintendent at Canton with powers and instructions calculated to provide against the growing evils connected with the contraband traffic in opium, and adapt .1 to the novel and difficult situation iii which the Superin- tendent was pla-ed."

Mr. Mocot. LA v stated the defence of the Government. He was much pleased to find, that after the closest examination of a series of transac- ing so extensivd and complicated, an assailant possessing Sir James Graham's industry and talent could only produce such a resolution—a resolution the terms of which were entirely retrospective, and indeed related to no point of time more recent than a year ago, and which con- tained no condemnation of the present policy of the Ministers. Mr. Macaulay then applied himself to show that the Government was not liable to censure for any portion of their conduct in relation to Chinese affairs. He dwelt upon the impossibility of giving minute instructions to a functionary fifteen thousand miles off. It was absolutely neces- sary that he should be at liberty to act upon his own discretion when extraordinary and unforeseen circumstances arose. The principle on which it was admitted that India must be governed in India, was applicable to the conduct of English affairs in China. The circum- stances which had produced the hostile position of this country towards China were unforeseen and extraordinary, and could not have been prevented by instructions from Downing Street. He challenged Sir James Graham to point out any one difficulty which a de- spatch from the Foreign Secretary would have prevented. Then as to the detailed charges : in the first place, Captain Elliot had actually obtained permission to reside at Canton ; and secondly, he was allowed to communicate directly with the Chinese authorities. These two points had been conceded, and there was therefore no necessity for correcting the Order in Council or the instructions. Then, the Duke of Wellington's recommendation respecting the naval force referred to times of trouble ; and subsequently, as Sir George Robinson's despatches

showed, friendly intercourse was resumed. As to putting down the smuggling-trade in opium, it was impossible, without the caperation of the Chinese authorities, to stop it. The Government of England, with its large preventive force and a comparatively limited range of coast to guard, could not prevent extensive smuggling of brandy. Had Captain

Elliot, with insufficient force, issued a formal decree for the suppression of the trade, he could only have rendered himself liable to suspicion of insincerity. He adverted to the outrages committed by the Chinese on British subjects, who had always considered the presence of the British flag as a protection—

He had been much touched by one passage in the papers, where Captain Elliot commented upon his situation upon his arrival at the stairs at Canton,

when surrounded by his countrymen, the English ensign was taken from the

boat and hoisted upon the factory. It was natural that the English Super- intendent should look to that important flag, which had never been insulted without retaliation by barbarians. We had compelled the Dey of Algiers to

bow down to the dust before the insulted Consul of England ; we had revenged the horrors of the Black Hole on the .plains of Plessy and the flag of England bad never been insulted with impunity since the day when the Protector declared he would make the name of an Englishman as much re- spected as that of a Roman citizen of old. That flaw should be the pro- tection of an Englishman, however remote; and the Government of this country would not stiffer one of its subjects to be harmel with impunity. He had ,listened with anxiety to the sentiments expressed by Sir James

Graham, and he collected from his speech that he would lie disposed to pre-

vent our exacting, redress from the Chinese Government. He did not believe the House would tolerate a course so v and palpably unjust ; and if there was to be a change of men, he trusted there would in this respect be no change of measures. He should only further express a sincere hope, that the efforts of those who were intrusted with the duty of extmting reparation from the Chinese, by an exhibition of English power comhined with English mercy and moderation, might be overruled IT the cure of a gracious Providence, which so often produced good out of seeming evil, and that the circumstances which had forced its to to these measures would terminate in a lasting peace, alike beneficial to England and to China.

Sir WILLIAM FOLLETT complimented Mr. Macaulay on his eloquence, but thought his speech calculated to withdraw the attention of the

house from the real question before it. He contended that the charge of unjustifiable neglect of the afiliirs of China had not been rebutted; and proceeded to substantiate this charge, by reference to dates of let-

ters from the Superintendents in China, and of Lord Palmerston's de-

spatches. He read some of those despatches, to show what slight at- tention Lord Palmerston paid to the important communications he re-

ceived from China, and the cold neglect with which Captain Elliot's entreaties for a force to put down the opium-trade were received. Sir William also dwelt upon the injustice of attempting by force of arms to make China amenable to the international law of Europe— The guestion in this instance was whether we had a right to apply the in- ternational law of Europe to a peaq:le who did not recognize it—who did not acknowledge it—who had no comprehension or understanding of it.? The Chinese Government would not allow either a fbreitm ambassador, or minister,

or consul. to reside in its dominions. How couhrthis war justified upon

the ground of a breach of the international law of Europe, when the whole of our intercourse with China had proceeded upon the assumption that they knew nothing of that international law, and, e011,C,1110110Y, that they were not subject to it? Under these circumstances, it' the British Sulterini'endent re- siding at Canton refused to allow n British subject who had violated the Chinese laws to be tried by the Chinese laws. and if the Chinese authorities then proceeded to take steps which, by a strict interpretation of the interna- tional law of Europe, could not be just-hied, still he shattld entertain the gravest doubts whether a war, based upon such ground., eauld lic considered as justifiable. What was the position in which we stood ? We were conoantly violating the Chilies,. laws, with which we were well enough tlequainted ; and yet we said, we will not allow the Chinese to infringe upon ally of our Eu- ropean international laws, with which they were in noway,: acquainted. Al- though we were constantly refusing submission to their law—,mnstantly break- ing their law—constantly carrying out a contraband trade in defiance of their law—yet we will not permit them to violate anv part of oar international law. He was never an advocate for war—he reg.:111W it it all times as an evil that few pretexts could justify ; but it' from anv uncontrollable circumstance it should be necessaiT for this country to mate an appeal to arms lie should wish that the ground upon which that appeal mos inado should be free from all doubt. The Chinese had been deseribed by Captain Elliot as a people looking only for justice ; and lie confessed he should be very sorry to give his con- 'ploiftet\v.ar,Buunt, sent to our letting loose upon them all the horrors and ralainitaii less the justice of our resort to hostilities was clear and mi whether just or unjust, he was quite sure that Mr. Macaulay was quite mis- taken when he expressed his belief that the feeling out of bors would be in favour of a war with China, based upon the principles %Odell that gentleman enunciated. He wouldf von.un; 1 0 t nil thuk' right ILmourallo gentleman and her 'Majesty's Government, that there trust grow ing haling out of doors respecting the foreign relations of this country, %%hid' e onla induce all the thinking por- tion of the nation to view With great apprehension the commencement of a war with the Chinese. Once commenced, it was impossible to foresee where such a war would end.

Sir GEORGE STA UNTON was surprised that Sir James Graham's reso- lution omitted all notice of the war with China. For his own part, however, he rejoiced that the war, which he considered just and neces- sary, had received the tacit approbation of the House. Ile was fully prepared for its being a protracted NN or ; and therefore it was the bounden duty of all who thought it unjust or impolitic, to enter their protest against it— He thought that those who entertained such opinions were bound to express them without any further delay, because it was still possible that a fast-sailing vessel might stop the war. He was not at all in the confidence of the Govern- ment ; he knew nothing whatever of the course they intended to pursue, ex- cept from what had been publicly announced M that House, or in the news- papers. Therefore, in expressing his approbation of the general principles upon which the Government seemed disposed to proceed, he reserved to him- eelf the full right of objecting to any details which should appear to him to be objectionable.

He explained that it was under a new law that Commissioner Lin had proceeded with so much rigour against the British in China— The former course had been, when the edicts were not obeyed, to suspend the trade of the country, and the last step was to expel those who set the laws at defiance. Up to the arrival of Commissioner Lin, there was no other law. There was no Chinese law for confiscation of goods on board ship outside the river. When the Imperial Commissioner arrived at Canton, he brought with him a new law of a very extraordinary and severe character—a law denoun- cing death against ally foreigner that traded in opium, and subjecting his pro- perty to confiscation to the Crown. However severe this law might be said to be, it might be justified : but to attempt to punish those under the new law who had arrived in China ander the old late, must be condemned by all parties as a most atrocious injustice. There was no law before in China by which the hair of the head of any European could have been touched for smuggling. He therefore said, that an act of such atrocious injustice, without looking at all to any subsequent events which had occurred, was a full justification of the measures which had been taken to exact reparation.

Sir George proceeded to defend the war, mainly on the ground that an exhibition of the military power of England towards China was, under the circumstances, absolutely necessary to maintain the political ascendancy of this country in India. [Sir George was indistinctly beard, and his speech is so imperfectly reported, that we cannot alto- gether follow the train of his reasoning.] • Mr. HERBERT regretted that Sir George Staunton had not spoken more explicitly. It was complained that the censure applied was re- trospective; but Mr. Herbert was at a loss to know how any censure could be prospective. If asked why they did not seek a vote of censure on the future policy of the Government, the answer was, it was impos- sible to guess what that policy would be. As to the warlike proceed- ings, if the difficulties with China arose from jealousy and fear of Eng- land's military power, the true policy of this country would be to ab- stain from war and maintain peace— There was nothing so calculated to excite such an apprehension in the minds of the Chinese, as our rapid and triumphant progress in India, begun by Lord Clive and completed by the two Wellesleys; there was nothing which would more tend to impress them with an idea of the restless and indomitable energy of our character. In his opinion, no one could read the volumes printed on this subject without coming to the same opinion upon it as the right honour- able baronet. It was to him quite clear that we were entering upon a war, with but very doubtful justice on our side, and, with this certain result—that we should very greatly impede a most valuable trade, a trade in an article essential to the morals of the large mass of the population of this country.

At the conclusion of Mr. Herbert's speech, Mr. BROTBERTON moved the adjournment of the debate to Wednesday : which was carried.

On Wednesday, the first speech was delivered by Mr. IlsavEs ; who remarked that Sir James Graham had avoided se- veral of the most important questions connected with his motion. Sir James said little about the opium-trade, and did not inform the House whether the Conservatives, if they should return to power, intended to protect or suppress the commerce in that drug. The fact was, that they could not put down the trade in opium—they could not do that which they blamed Ministers for not doing. Every attempt to sup- press the commerce in opium had failed. Notwithstanding the endea- vours to stop it, at the present time it was more flourishing than ever. He defended the course which Government had taken, and denied that they could be charged with a war of aggression on China. On the contrary, all which was demanded was reparation for unjust, illegal, and oppressive conduct.

Mr. THESIGER then addressed the House for the first time. He maintained that the motion was not brought forward in the spirit of party. The House was called upon to express its opinion, not whether the war with China was just or necessary, but whether it had been oc- casioned by the neglect or misconduct of Ministers. That was the question ; and it did not involve another—whether they who condemned the course which had been pursued would have adopted a different policy. The Opposition were not responsible for the measures of Go- vernment, and were not called upon to propound a policy of their own. As to the expression of an opinion on the policy of the war, that could scarcely be expected, when it was absolutely uncertain whe- ther the country was at war or not. Mr. Thesiger proceeded to argue, from the statements in the papers laid on the table, that Lord Pal- merston had neglected his duty ; that with regard to Chinese affitirs he had sunk into lethargy ; that the difficulties in -which the country was now involved had arisen front his not haviug complied with the en- treaties of the British authorities in China fbr instructions ; and that the Chisese had not provoked hostilities by any misconduct of their own. When asked what the Conservatives would have done, he re- plied — Tley would have pursued a totally different course in every respect from that e hieh had been adopted : they would have given definite instructions '5 our S., perinteudent to enable him to act with frill authority on every branch of tlii- and instructions which would, as he believed, have been the mem.- prevelitiog this fatal war; fatal he had a right to call it, for its Abets wou I I, . felt from one extremity of' the empire to the other, and from the higl-t to the lowest class. Ile ti:It satisfied that the evidence, when calmly consid, red, would fully bear out the terms of Sir .lames Graham's motion ; and, for himself, he had no hesitation III giving for that motion his hearty, his cordial Mr. CHARLES PA:Linn would not follow Mr. Thesiger into his ex- amination of the blue books, nor make any remarks on the commentary Mr. Thesiger made or, wka on he lb imud there ; but he wished much to know what excuse the Duke of Wellington and Sir James Graham could offer for the instructions to Lord Napier, to which Sir J011108 was a party, and to which the Duke of Wellington had directed Lord Napier to attend. Those instructions, it now appeared, were the source of the difficulties which had arisen. Yet it was attempted to place the Duke of Wellington's policy in favourable contrast with Lord Palmerston's The charges against Lord Palmerston were charges of omission ; bui gentlemen opposite were careful not to state what it was Lord Palmer- ston ought to have done, and which he omitted to do. The last charge to which Lord Palmerston was justly liable, in Mr. Buller's opinion, seas that of lethargy. Approaching the general question, Mr. Buller' admitted that the war with China might be protracted and serious ; and he did not complain that the Opposition expressed an opinion adverse to it, but that they had degraded this great question to one of mere party politics—a repetition of the " no confidence" motion of Sir John Buller. It was very fine to talk about precautions which might have prevented existing difficulties, but Sir James Graham and his supporters were bound to specify those precautions— There was a mighty difference between foresight and precaution, particularly when the foresight was a purely retrospective foresight. He was aware that this term was a bold innovation upon the English language, but lie must either use that or coin a new word, and call it "back sight." It was a retrospective fore- sight that enabled the right honourable baronet to predict what was passed, and to warn them against dangers that had already been incurred. But giving the right honourable baronet the benefit of all his ex post° facto foresight, what use would he have made of it ? Foreseeing all timings, what would he have done to bring about a different result ? This was what he ought to tell them: but this was what had uot been vouchsafed to them, either by him or try cay of those who have followed him in his course of vague inculpation. Of payee and instructions they talked boldly enough; but it was always of some powers and some instructions, without letting them know what. Before they blame Ministers for what they did do, or did not do, let them show what they would Immure done in their places, and that would have prevented the mischief that actually occurred. Indeed, he thought the fide thing would have been for Sir James Graham, in order to enable them fairly to contrast his vigorous and foreseeing policy with the actions of those who kept him out of office, to hove laid on the table of the Ilouse previously to the debate copies of all the de. spatches which he would have written to Captain Elliot had he been Foreign Secretary instead of Lord Palmerston.

A careful examination of the papers on the table had convinced him, that no foresight or sagacity on the part of Ministers could have pre- vented a collision with China; which was the inevitable consequence of the free trade established in 1833— Is the business had turned out, and as the noble lord had not prevented results which he believed it was utterly impossible for any human sagacity in his place to avert, he could lay claim to no merit except that which was after all a very great though not very brilliant one, of having prudently avoided making matters worse than they were made by events over which he had us control. But he could safely affirm, that the MOM he had attended to hie conduct as developed in these papers, the more decidedly did he think that he deserved no blame. He could point out no material instance in which lie could on reflection say that, either by acting differently, or by prescribing a different course to those under him, the noble lord could have brought about more de- sirable results. Faults there have, undoubtedly, been on both sides,—for be must frankly say that he was by 310 means convinced that the Chinese had been the only parties to blame; but the faults on our side had been faults of the general policy pursued by us as a nation. Our error has dated from that period when, having determined to throw open the trade with China to all our countrymen, we left it on a footing in which it was utterly impossible fur it to continue with either honour or security. Ile would not say that we were wrong in taking, away the East India Company's monopoly of the China trade; but if we were right in that, we were very wrong in not perceiving that that step was calculated to disturb all our existing relations with the Chinese ; and we were wrong in not making that complete change in our whole tootle of carrying on the trade which ought to have accompanied time one that we did make. lie must contbss that when he looked back to the change which we made in 1833, and considered the footing on which that change placed our re- lations with the Chinese, he could not but regret that our information at that time was so incomplete that we did not perceive that continued and scrim collision must be the immediate result of the position in which we placed ourselves.

He by no means considered the fears of the English entertained by the Chinese as chimerical or absurd, however foolish he might consider their means of precaution— Experience had taught them, undoubtedly, to fear the aggressions of fo- reigners, inasnmuch as they had often been overrun by them ; and if they now pointed these apprehensions at Europeans, and especially at the English, which of them would say that they had not great reason to suspect us of aggrauve designs ? There had been much to strengthen that suspicion. The fall of the dynasties in the East were not unknown. It had not been unheard of how one of the mightiest dynasties that ever filled the thrones of this world had fidlen before us. At the court of Aurungzebe a few merchants had suddenly asked permission to establish a trade in a distant part of' time territories; and they knew well that the last descendant of that ancient dynasty was new a pensioner of the successors of those very merchants. He regretted that the collision with China, which he was persuaded was inevitable, should have been caused immediately by the opium traffic-- It would have appeared that men possessing any foresight—he pretended to none—hut he thought that honourable gentlemen opposite, who claimed some credit for it, should have anticipated the events which had occurred; and ehould have said that a great contrail:Ind trade existing, which in a great mensore regulated the exchanges, and hieing more likely to increase rather than dumpish, care should be taken that no difference should arise out of it. Ile repeated his most sincere regret that the cause of quarrel shonld belie anywise connected with the monopoly of' the Kist Indio Company in the trade in opium ; for if ml were not so connected, tee should nut have the appearance in the eye of the world of being dragged into a dispute on account of a traffic carried on far the purpose of introdocing into China an article inanufaetured by that country to suit the Chinese taste. Ile called upon the House, however, imt to charge all the mischief which had oreerred upon the Ministry. They did not create the monopoly, for there never had been a monopoly more openly established, or more deliberately sanctioned by this House. It was said indeed that power should have been given to Captain Elliot to pint down the opium traffic in the river amid port of Cunton- lie must say that lie thought that u Govermnent which had done such is thing would base been guilty or an act of the greatest insanity. Were they to consider what was desiralde, or what was really practicable ? Was the exPe.; rience a every nation to be thrown away, mid were they to 'suppose that t! there was an article of produce for Arhiell the Chinese possessed so geuerati a desire, it was in the power of our Government to take measures to prevea their of it—that we could do for China what Napoleon had faded to do on the Continent, and enfiwee those new Milan decrees throughout the Celestmat Empire ? Why, the force of law to render the trade illegal was not wanted. Honourable Members talked us if the smuggling of opium was a legal trail% No asaistunce from this country was wanted to make the traffic illegal, for

was already declared to be earned on in opposition to the existing laws of China. Ths levee, the flamingly-luminous statutes of the Celestial Empire, were well known, but the people who were engaged in the trade cared nothing for them, and put them at defiance. If this course then had been adopted, we must have sent out a sufficient force to Captain Elliot to enforce this new commercial code. The smuggling-trade might be driven from Canton, but it would have been carried on in a manner far more disgraceful, and far nuire dangerous, all

along the coast ; and in n order to carry out the views which were sup- ported, and upon which this country was required to put down the trade, we must have despatched to the Superintendent a coast blockade far greater than the force we had for that purpose in England; and the ultimate effect would have been the establishment of the most mischievous and the most sanguinary warfare which could possibly exist. The noble lord the Secretary for Foreign Affairs, however, might yet have adopted another course. He might have come down, and, at any rate, as was contended, he might have paid a tribute of re-

spect to decency and good feeling, and he might have proposed that the opium- onopoly enjoyed by the East India Company should be done away with. m

Supposing he had done that, and had proposed that in the course of three or four months the whole of the traffic should be swept away at once, upon what authority, he begged to ask. would he have taken that step? The only ground which he ivould have had upon which to support such a proposition, would have been the despatch from the Superintendent, Captain Elliot, telling him what ? To take measures to put an end to the traffic P—No, but to take the steps proper to procure the legalization of the trade. Of canine, such a proposition, so evidently founded

propriety, would have root with that degree of Support on good sense and which it deserved. Honourable Members opposite would have maintained that same dignified freedom from party warfare which they had always shown. Not one word would have been heard of the impubey of such a course, un- supported by any information than that which had been received : they would hive forgotten the impoliey of the proceeding, in their anxiety to promote the cause of humanity ; reckless of majorities, of constituents, or of general elections, they would have assented to the proposition without an question.

klt perfectly confident, that it the noble lord the Secretary for Foreign Affairs bad made any such proposition on any such authority at that time, he would not long have kept anybody out of the post which he held, for be would have been placed under such .proper restraiut as would have prevented his longer performing the ditties of his office. Referring to the question of powers invested in the British Superin- tendent, lair. Buller reminded Sir James Graham of his opposition to Lord Palmerston's Chinese Courts Bill, intended to enlarge these powers ; and with regard to the Duke of Wellington's advice to place two vessels of war at the disposal of the Superintendent, Mr. Buller remarked, that while he entirely concurred in the Duke's dictum that , during a period of disturbance it would be advisable to back the Super- intendent with such a force—and to that extent only the Duke's recom- mendation went—he entirely differed with gentlemen opposite on the question of keeping armed vessels constantly on the Chinese coast ; for nothing would tend more to provoke hostilities and sweep away trade— There never had been an exhibition of a maritime power in the Chinese seas, without a great deal of irritation being produced in the minds of the Government of that country. Let them look at the case of Admiral Mait- land: he had not been in the outside waters two days, before mes,sige on Ines- sage was sent him from the nearest authorities nu shore, to ask his business, and to beg hint to go away. Let them look at the consequences which had arisen from the iiiesence of two men-of-war during. Lard Napier's unhappy administration; for he believed tint the visit which then took place was the came of all the ill-treatment that Lord Napier then experienced. In conclusion, Mr. Buller said he thought they were discussing a mere party question. The motion could only have teen brought for- ward with party objects, and be hoped the Donee would treat it as an ueworthy and unsubstantial attack upon the Government.

Mr. GLADSTONE admitted that the Duke of Wellington had written but one despatch to Lord Napier during the short period he held office, but that despatch was characteristic for its pithiness. It rebuked Lord Napier for using force when conciliation was advisable, and retOrred him to his instructions, which by no means bore out Lord Napier in some of his proceedings. The Duke did more : he carefully weighed the subject, and before he quitted office left a memorandum of advice, which, had it been followed, would have prevented the disastrous state of affairs which the House had now to consider. It was urged as a complete defence for the present Government, that they were only charged with sins of omission. But such thults might produce fatal consequences. A son allowed his father to starve—that was only a sin of omission : a statesman did not prevent an unjust war—that also was only a sin of omission. The charge against Government was neglect of duty—not that they had been unable or unwilling to strike out some new line of policy. Reference had been made to the China Courts 13ill ; but there again Lord Palmerston had omitted to perffirm his duty. Though aware of the growing difficulties respecting the opium-trade, and their great importauce, not one word did he utter. not a tittle of information did he communicate to Parliament on the sub- ject. The Chinese Courts Bill might have been considered necessary, if the inffirmation iv hick Lora Palmerston suppressed had been com- municated, as it ought to have been, to tite Douse. Lord Palinereton was responsible for the inadequacy of the Superintendent's powers. His grand omission was the neglect to intbrin Parliament of the filets known to him officially, which might have setislieil Parliament of tlw -necessity of interference in the affairs of lair Mojesty's subjects who were carrying. on the opium-trade at defiance rif the laws of China. Mr: G ladst one insist ed wi th much earnestness on lb is charge. 1 to maintained that 1. iii Palmerston had been possessed of intimination which rendered it imperative on him to consult Parliament ; and that iill the disasters which had since occurred might have been prevented, if, instead of no communications at all or garbled ix trails from despatches, the Foreign lt4cecetary had communicated to I li Douse of Commons a fitir and complete statement of' the eireienstanees which embarrassed the English relations with Chinn. In order to make out a ease for Lord Palmerston, the Chinese Covertintent Leen unfairly treated in the debate : and Mr. Gladstone referred to the proceedings of that Government, their repeated warnings, mid edict, all disregarded, to show that their conduct had been the reve'rse oh' violent or pre- cipitate. It was said that the Chinese authorities had contbunded the innocent with the guilty—that they had confined two hundred persons without reference to their criminality as regarded the opium-trallic but he asked whether out of the two hundred there were so many as five persons not implicated in breaeltes of the law prohibitiug the in- Mr. WARD supported Government on this questioo, not because he considered the opium-trade moral or immoral, but because the Chinese had abandoned every semblance of respect for the principles of inter- national law ; and because he saw no other means of averting evils which impended over them, than those which the Guvernment prepared 'air. GEORGE PALMER spoke on the other side ; and dwelt upon the commercial losses and embarrassincloe likely to arise from the Chinese war. Ile referred to his own experience of the hospitable and friendly character of the Chinese.

Both Mr. Ward and Mr. Palmer addressed a thin, noisy, and inatten- tive audience ; and the debate was adjourned at half-past twelve.

Mr. llocc opened the debate on Thursday. He observed that the question of the policy of the \Vat' was not raised by the motion, and he should therefore refrain from discuseing it. lie was ready to admit, however, that under existbass circumstances, this country could not treat with China with honour and effect except in the press :lee of an army. llis charge against Ministers was, that their neglect and mis- conduct had brought the counfry to this exigency. Mr. 'loge took the same course as Sir James Graham and miler supperters of the motion, IL) make good this allegation itainett the eioverament ; making copious USit of the materials supplied by " the Blue Book."

Dr. Lusnisaeroo admitted that the Cainese amitorities had a right to puniele according to Chinese le w e, the Beitish suajeets detained in sumegling opium ; and he admitted that the cole of law. called he law of nations, could not be rigidly eaplied to a couatry so singular and so strange ae China—haltacivilized, hahabarbarous—an tmomale in the history of nations. Ile would go aleiher. and admit that (Adria might have an equitable claim ou the Britieli Government for assist once to put down the opium-trade, if her own functienaries honestly exerted them- selves to stop it. But the fact was, that the Chinese authorities con- nived at and encouraged the commeree which they called upen Captain Elliot to suppress; and then tiley adopted measures of suppression and punishment not only inconsise.nt NV iIi the law of nations, but with every principle of justice and humanity—with the law of' God and with the law of man." lalr. eel:Cleo-me had justified the proceedings of the t'hinese authoritiee in a neemer which Dr. Luehingtou declared filled him with " horror"—

lie respected that hobouralle Member; he admired his talents : knew the honourable gentletnan to be a r.ot ehantidon in ev,:ry citise he thought

to be right ; but he owned he siamihh ii, or cease to ref -re: ate the ar,rnment which the honourable izentloctin used last night. or to a%ow his ale,rrei.es of the doctrines he eudea'vourcd maint...im Upon what principle could the i:‘,:aure of men, who were living in Canton under the protection of that country's usag:•s. be justified ? 17postto Ilat 1,rimiei1 h esriht t tirtac :11,n be made responsi-

ble for the tafenees of others: Not e.d:: ..0 these m wo hundred persons without any proof of trial maligned, but : y , ere seizcd : and then. under the greatest durance, and under the threat i V rired to die by starva-

tion, they had not only their own 'wore:- !hem, bat, in order to enrich the Chinese Government, III, :sautryinen were likewise practised upon to compel the:.1 • in order to save the lives of those long-emloring and mos: pers....is 'Plat was mu act of at rued v that no usagtu no custom. n., , ',ovular ptejnilices in China, ever would, or ought to allow En:tlaiai , .to.. much less to sanction. It a grievous sin—a is [eked oireace—.:r . i.ocioas violation of justice. for which England had the 1.1,-ht, i strici Oght to demand repara- tion by three it' refused to pcaeLabIe !,illowed? Expulsion. Was it expulsion alum. Iron' :N,i ; to Mae:WS Was of the po, •tee. j,. this ,,,• y ,:ent nneirenti- ing men, women, ana \i ext W by. • vnravtiee. Whieh 11,7111 till 111:4 •• ,U3S :11 I,ImmIitmttl,

ory. trom the ea: ,

cl0111 thliay WIICII it was praeti,a ;,• :.v ears ago- . vt211 1111111:i.:: the time of open w a it might lit seed almost to he done in sLX-ild'ence. reprobation of

poisoning that

all the world—the Is-aet ice. not ot CU: source of life., by IN WWII 11:It til: mien and helpless • . to Lis ev‘-elasi:ng children. were indiscriminately wonder and :istontshment, there fL c V VV.V Nlentber for Newark another ever-memorable expre,,sien,'I VVV I. V r ML:nler said that the

English were ordered to put : they .•■ Iney cre ilcprnol it pro-

visions; and, of course,- coot inue,1 the VV raitie Memb.r. " the water was poisoned." Those ncct the Ver■ Lt: heard them at the time: they were so reported ; and they et Lae true. ile ia5Iut ettuor. i" ' nal.: were troduction of opium ? The fact is, that the whole British community were implicated in the smuggling of opium ; and Mr. Gladstone main- tained, that as the Chinese Government were utterly unable to proceed judicially against the offenders, they were justified in adopting the measures which are now alleged as righteous grounds of war against them. But it was said that the war is not condemned by the Opposi- tion ; that Sir James Graham's resolution is beside the point at issue and spiritless ; and that the motion is brought forward merely for party purposes. This Mr. Gladstone denied— The war =I been denounced by more than one speaker on his side of the House, and most justly denounced, as a war which if successful would bring no honour, but which if unsuccessful would involve us in utter and indelible die- grace. If he were of opiuion, as was suggested, that this motion would have no effect on the war, he should have comparatively little interest in its fate. The imputation that the charge involve,h was merely made for party purposes, was hardly worth a passing notice. If the party opposite escaped on this di- vision, they would be veiled on to show cause hereafter for the intentions which they had declared with respect to China. Ile did not mean to say that we should not have to send an armament out to China. The Government had placed its in such a position by their continuons misconduct, that, unhappily, it was pretty certain that we should obtain no terms of any kind withotft having recourse to some such proceeding. We were going, it appeared, to exact reparation for insults, to exact compensation for opium which we were endeavouring to smuggle into China ; but when we were called upon to show what the insults were which we had received, he apprehended we should have some difficulty in furnishing a reply. The British flag was now hoested for the protection of a contraband trade. ln a war undertaken with such an ob- ject, Lord Palmerston was now solely chargeable ; but if the House rejected Sir James Graham's condemnatory resolittion, it mould adopt the reepousibility of all the evil cunsequences of the Foreign Secretary's limits. With respect to the conduct of Government, Dr. Lushing•ton had taxed his ingenuity to discover what were those measures within the competency and power of Government, he had almost said of Parlia- ment itself, which would have averted the calamitous consequences which had ensued—

He was satisfied that, when the country became acquainted with the sub- ject, and that when the merits of the case were sifted, they would agree with him in opinion, that no precaution and no foresight on the part of the Government could have anticipated or could haVe prevented the present calamities, and that no instructions that could have been given would, according to the terms of the motion, have had any effect in preventing the rupture, whether those In- structions had related to the opium-trade or not ; for, to say that any such effect would have been produced if they had referred to a trade which had been so long permitted, which was so closely connected with the feelings of the Chinese, which never could have been broken off without producing a rup- ture, and which it was in evidence that the Chinese were determined to con- tinue even at the risk of their lives, did appear to him to be absurd.

Lord SANDON saw an apology for the conduct of the Chinese Go- vernment in the fact, that within a few years the trade in opium had been enormously increased. While the annual imports did not exceed 5,000 or 6,000 chests, the evil might not appear of such magnitude as to require severe measures to 6Iop its progress, but when the imports were swelled to 25,ono or :ay es0 chests, and the trade extended all along the coast, it was easy to account for the alarm of the Chinese Government, and the adoption of serious measures of repression be- came natural and justifiable. Lord Sandon then applied himself to the question before the House—whether Ministers did not deserve censure for neglect of duty : and he argued that they were highly blameable,— supporting his arguments by quotations from the papers produced by Ministers for their justification. He called upon the Government to state precisely what they were going to do with their large fleet and army ; and how they were going to deal with the opium-trade?

- Sir Jolts; Hoenouse concurred iu the view that bad been taken of the magnitude of the struggle in which the country was about to en- gage. It was impossible to overrate its magnitude, or its probable con- sequences ; and if indeed this war had been occasioned by the neglect of Government, then indeed Ministers deserved not only this vote of censure, but impeachment. The motion, however, though it implied censure, settled nothing— Did it ask the House for a vote whether or not we should go to war with China; whether they should take any course to prevent it ; whether they should send out to the Covernor-General of India to suspend any of these ope- rations which his noble friend and himself bad, on the responsibility of their office, desired him to undertake ? It did no such thing. Honourable gentle- men opposite said that mischief had occurred They tried to get a vote against their opponents for having been the cause of that which they, as well as the supporters of this motion. agreed to have been a calamity ; but they did no snore than attempt to get that vote—he would not say for party purposes, be- cause he did not object to their acting for party purposes. With their views of the conduct of Government, they were quite right to act in any way whatever which they might think likely to lead to the displacing of the present Administration. Having said this, he trusted that be might not be supposed to be actuated by a desire of disparaging the right honourable gentleman, if he said that he recognised in his propo,t1 nothing but a mere party attempt—no- thing else in the world. Owning, as he did, Sir James Graham's perfect and entire right to make this effort, he would nevertheless expect to be laughed at in the face of day, if he did not declare that the house and the country, from one end to the other, were perfectly well aware that the supporters of the mo- tion cared no more about the Chinese in this matter than they had on a former occasion eared about Canada, or than they had cared about many other ques- tions on which they had agitated the country—to use an expression of the right honourable gentleman opposite, when be said they had transferred agita- tion from England to Canton : but at the same time he could not help recommending gentlemen opposite to take the advice given them by the honourahle and learned Member for Exeter in his learned and powerful speech, (learned and powerful as the honourable and learned Member's speeches must from habit and necessity always be,) when he said to them " do not trifle with a question of war or lance." He begged to offer to them the same advice—not to trifle with a question of war or rwo. If they wanted to catch party votes, let them squabble about Itei-tratioa Bills, about Maynooth College, or any other points of domestic policy which, as Sir William Follett said, had diverted the attention of Government from the consideration of foreign affairs.

Ministers were charged with want of foresight, and neglect of pre- cautions to put down the opium-trade : but all the circumstances of the trade were known long ago to the Duke of Wellington and Sir Robert Peel. It was no new question—.

A Committee sat in 1810 to diamei the renewal of the East India Com- pany's charter, and at the same time examined the case of the opium-trade. 7.)id that Committee make a report ? Yes, it did. Did that report say any thing against the smuggling of opium: No, it did not. There wae another Committee which inquired. into the same subject in I ft•:!2. Did that Com- mittee make any report as to the smuggling-trade in opium ? It did. Va. rious witnesses were examined ; the atrocities, us they had most properly been called, of the trade were inquired into ; a report was drawn up, and the evi- dence given, more particularly that of Mr. Shepherd and Mr. Marjoribanks, and the whole bearings of the trade were thoroughly sifted. Yet some gentle- men spoke of this matter as if it now f...hie imeli,re the !louse for the first time. What was the opitlion of the Coro emit tee of 15,12? Why, that as the opium- trade ef Bengal produced es easa, it was not desirable, in the existing state of the revialue of India, to put an cod to it ; the more so as the duty fell chiefly on the foreign comouner.

Yet the present Ministers were to be censured for not suppressing the illicit trade in opium, es if they alone were responsible for it ! lie denied the pre.:ihil:ty of putting down the smugglers of opium : and to

show the cans. ••e rdf ih, 10t,;I1itS recently made with that view, be would read le: rt of a mle,patmli front Lord Auckland, and of a letter to the Seeret Committee if tae I:a., Iudia Company--

Lord A ecklaml, in hi, :••'t .1 •! the 13th of February, said—" In the men, time, oer opium I, !,g in pi ice, and Nellie of our merchants are making fortunes by sales oa the 1. ci cm,ard of China." lie begged to call the

particular atteseen of the I lon ..: to the next statement in the letter, which was so startling, that without sorb high authority he could not believe it. Lord A uck land ,ailt—" One entail ertti.er came in last week with 70,000 pounds in sycee silver." This was brOlIght in by one cruiser as the first of one small adventure ; arid this showeil that the effect of the repressive measures was ly to drive time trade to the Eastern coast of China. It was another evideoee of the cifeets of Ii. ii.': rept. iv e measures which gentlemen seemed to think ought to bac,: lieun ;inlopt,,d so Mafia sooner. The next letter was to

the Secret Cerenattee, andre ; f • rred to the Chinese ea peditiOli. It said, "as

to the armament of light ves ais the best adapted to this service are the fast- sailing brigs or barques known here under the denomination of opium-clip, At present, however, the trade in opium is so lucrative that it is quite un. possible to obtain any one of them, all of them being actually employed oe that coast. As it is probable, however, that the course of operations m Chins may interfere with the traffic, it is possible that some of them may feel inclined to accept charters from us." Thus, such was the activity of the trade, tug one small cruiser brought home 70,0001. in sycee silver ; and such was the demand for opium-clippers, that not one of them was to be procured for send- ing out on the expedition. Nothing could show more clearly the hopeless- ness of any attempt to put down opium-smuggling. He had documents which would show the impossibility of succeeding in any such attempt. It appeared that 42,000 chests of opium was the amount of the produce of all the countries in which the poppy was cultivated. Of this amount 20,000 chests came from British India. The remainder came from territories which leer° not totally independent, but in which we could not exercise any influence sufficient to put down that cultivation. This portion was principally the produce of that pare of India called Mabee. Treaties in reference to the subject, and called opium treaties, had been made with the native princes, but were aunulled because they were found totally inapplicable to the circumstances. They did not enable the Government to control the cultivation of the poppy in those territories or the export of it. In 1830aliose treaties were changed for the presentsystem of a stamp-duty; that system yielded 200,000/. a year. Suppose the trade to be Jet loose, and the Government to take no duty. Would that prevent the culti- vation of the poppy in Malwa ? It would do no such thing. It would only increase the cultivation of it.

The object of the armament against China was not profit for Eng- land alone, but that of every other civilized power in the world ; anti Sir John Hobhouse trusted, that the war would be so conducted as to vindicate the honour of England, improve the relations of the Chinese with all the nations of the universe, and do good to the general inte. rests of humanity.

Sir ROBERT PEEL was not surprised at manifestations of weariness

towards the close of the last speech, from Members who had been oc- cupied with continued debate for six nights—three on the Corn-laws, and three on the China question ; but he entreated them to recollect, that although no communication had been made from the Throne—. though no message had been sent to Parliament on the subject—it ap- peared from the distinct and intelligible declarations of two Ministers of the Crown, that this country was on the eve of hostilities with a nation described by Sir George Staunton as exceeding in resources and in population all the European nations pet together. Nay, it was pos. sible that England at that very moment had entered into hostilities with three hundred and fifty millions of souls, little short of one-third of the whole human race— Could the Government be surprised that, with these indications of hostilities, which no one could now mistake, although the Crown had sent don f oisvnoiioccoomm...

munication to this House—had invited no opinion from the i

mono on the subject—could they be surprised that the House of Commons should proceed to inquire what were the causes, and with whom rested the re- sponsibility of this great and acknowledged calamity ? " Oh ! " said the right honourable gentleman the President of the Board of Control, and who was one of the parties to this great evil, " for God's sake discourse of any thing but the affairs of China; take up the Registration Bill, or take a vote about Maynooth,"—or perhaps the right honourable gentleman might advise the House even to occupy its time with a discussion about the Glasgow University Peel Club ; " but as to the great question of China—with whom rested the responsibility of the present hostilities, amid by what means they were brought about, do not touch them, for they are questions in which the alternative of peace or war is involved." (Opposition cheers.) It was complained that this was a party motion : what was the use of this constant and unmeaning clamour about party motions ?-

Was it necessarily a party proceeding to discuss the conduct of Government,

and the motives of their policy in an important foreign relation ? and if so, what were the means which the Government resorted to to defeat that pro- ceeding? Was it a perfectly novel thing in the history of the Government of this country, and in the history of Oppositions, to find motions brought forward criminating, and not prospectively, but retrospectively, the foreign policy of this country? What event of the late war, he would ask, had not been made the subject of inquiry by the Opposition? Had the expedition to the Scheldt escaped? Had the convention of Ceara escaped ? Had the battle of Talavera escaped? In fact, was there any instance in which, on questions involving the foreign policy of the Government of their country, those who watched the con- duct of the Government of the day had not thought themselves perfectly enti- tled to bring forward motions on the subject ? What was the motion put by the Marquis of Lansdowne in 1810—a great military critic—(Ironical cheers)-- who questioned the policy of the convention of Cintra, and cast retrospective, not prospective, censure upon it ; and who, not content with doing that in 1809, very shortly after his succeeding to the Peerage, brought forward in another field two resolutions condemnatory of the campaign in Spain. Those two resolu- tions, moved in the House of Lords by the Marquis of Lansdowne in 1810, ran thus-

1. " That it appears to this House, after the most attentiv e examination of the papers

laid belimre them, relative to the tale campaign in Spain, that the of the army

was improvidently and uselessly risked, and every loss and volatility waved, without ;monition whielt to expect any good result ; and that the whole did end in the retreat of the alley.

2. " That previous to entering on this campaign. Ministers did not procure the acces- sary information °role state of spoilt, or el its military resoulees—or the supplies that

could he &e. as the most (anions policy required; and that the result of Olt rashness and ignoranea was naoSt tttt ituus."

Sir Robert referred to motions by Mr. Fox and Lord John Cavendish, arraigning the conduct of the Ministers of the day, and which might serve as precedents for Sir JamesIGraham's motion, if a precedent were needed. Applying himself to the charge against Ministers contained in that motion Sir Robert remarked, that if the Government had neglected to send out full and proper instructions to Superintendents in China, it was no excuse for that neglect that those functionaries were 15,000 miles off. Neither did it follow, that because "India was best governed in India," according to Mr. Macaulay's ex- pression, the Superintendents of British trade at Canton would not re- quire instructions from Downing Street—

Why, what a wretched case the right honourable gentleman must have, when he fancied there was any analogy between the Government of India

and the position in which Captain Elliot was placed To say that, with a regularly-constituted Government—with subordinate civil officers of the great- est skill and experience—with persons accustomed to look up to that Govern: ment with reverence and respect—with a powerful fleet at its cominand—wita an immense military establishment—and with recognized laws and usages- " it seems to me that India may. be best governed in India, and therefore Cap- tain Elliot can conduct the affairs 41f China without instructions "—proved to him when such an argument was used, and such an analogy pretended to be discovered by a person of the right honourable gentleman's acuteness, that miserable indeed must be the case which was attempted to be supported on seek grounds. If this were the case—if they had furnished their Superintend-

ent with the full authority with which they were enabled to furnish slei—if they had passed an order in Council, which they were en- abled to do, first of all specifying the regulations which they wished to have established, and then describing what should constitute a breach

of them, and hial next constituted a Court of Admiralty, and criminal jurisdiction as they might have done,—if, likewise, they had indicated to him

the general views and policy of the Government, and said, " Here are the powers with which the law enables us to invest you; here are our general views and intentions, with respect to our relations with China, with respect to the trade in opium, with respect to your place of residence and the mode of com-

munication; we tie you down to no specific instructions ; we leave you, on account of your distance from the Home Government, full latitude and com- plete discretionary authority, confiding in your prudence and judgment,"—

then, indeed, they might have some case to rely on in the absence of detail and definition. But their course had been exactly the reverse. They gave him the semblance without the reality of power. They gave him a broken reed to rest on; they pretended to give 1nm an authority which, when it came to be examined, turned out to be an empty name; they not Merely withheld instructions, they gave him contradictory instructions; and then

they pretend, that on account of the distance it was difficult to explain the course which he was to pursue. Did the East India Company find that diffi- culty ? Read the despatch of the East India Company addressed to their Supercargoes in the year 1832, enjoining caution in dealing with the Chinese, and placing before them the general views of the Company, but not binding them down in that case at least to minute instructions ; and after having read that despatch, let him ask whether the vindication now set up by the Govern- ment, that they were 15,000 miles from their officers in India, could be deemed a sufficient excuse for the gross and intolerable negligence which it appeared they had committed ?

In support of the general charge of neglect, Sir Robert referred to the long intervals during which no despatches were sent to Captain Elliot, and the want of precise and full directions in the despatches which were sent. He quoted the following passage from a despatch p1.8491;branch from Superiniendebt, Ent l'eneived on the 13th January

"It had been clear to me, my Lord, from the origin or In

of the opium-traflie, that it must grow to be more and more mischievous to every branch of the trade, and certainly to none more than to that of opium itself As the danger and shame of its pursuit increased, it was obvious that it would fall by rapid degrees into the hands of more and more desperate loon; that it would stain the foreign character with constantly aggravating disgrace in the sight of the whole of the better portion of this people ; and, lastly, that it would connect itself more and more intimately with our lawful commercial intercourse, to the great peril of vast public aMil private interests. Till the other day, my Lord, I believe there was no part of the world where the foreigner felt his life and property more secure than in Canton; but the grave events of the 12th ult, have left behind a different impression. For a space of near two hours, the foreign factories were within the power of an immense and infuriated mob ; the gate of one of them was absolutely battered in, and a pistol was fired out—probably without ball, or over the heads of the people, for at least it is certain that nobody fell. If the ease had been otherwise, her Majesty's Government and the British public would have had to learn that the trade and peaceful intercourse with this empire was indefinitely interrupted by a terrible tee me of bloodshed and ruin. And all these desiserate hazards have been incurred, my Lord, for the scrambling, and, comparatively considered, Insignificant gains of a few individuals, unquestionably foundiug their conduct upon the belief that they were exempt from the operation of all law, British or Chinese."

Having received this statement in one of a series of despatches, which arrived up to the 13th of January 1839, what did Lord Palmerston do ?

He replied on the 13th of June ; and Sir Robert Peel asked whether, on a subject of such immense and complicated interests, such a letter as the following was a proper reply to the communications received by the British Government ?

" Foreign Office, 13th June 1839.

" Sir—Your despatches to the 31st December of last year, and to the 30th of January of this year, have been received and laid before her Majesty's Go- vernment. With reference to these despatches which detail the circumstances which led to an interruption of the trade for a short period in December last, and the steps which you took, its consequence, with a view to the reopening of the trade, and to the rdstablishment of your official communication with the Chinese authorities, I have to signify to you the entire approbation of her Ma- jesty's Government of your conduct on these matters. But II,arc at the same Lime to instruct you, not to omit to avail yourself of any proper opportunity to press for the substituthm qf a less oyectionable character th«n the character of ' Phi' on the superscription of the communications which you way hare occasion to address to the Viceroy.

"

lam, &c., " PALMERSTON." He would now call attention to the one point on which he should in- sist as the ground of his censure of the Government—

Ile meant to support the charge that her Majesty's Government did not give to their Superintendent the powers which they might have given—powers which were essential to the performance of his functions—powers with which, by the act of Parliament, they were fully entitled to invest him—and powers with which he might have materially contributed to avert the calamity which had befallen us.

On this part of the question Sir Robert dwelt at great length. He read extracts from the despatches of the Superintendents contain- ing urgent applications for enlarged powers, and especially for the establishment of a civil jurisdiction over British subjects in China,—a species of authority which Captain Elliot distinctly said the Chinese would readily permit to be exercised within their territory and Lord Palmerston had introduced two bills with the view of placing such authority in the Superintendent's hands : but those bills were not pressed till towards the close of the sessions of 1837 and 1838, when they were withdrawn fur want of time to consider them and the evi- dence of the necessity of such measures, though in Lord Palmerston's possession, was withheld from Parliament. This suppression of most important information was a most culpable part of Lord Pahnerston's conduct. But he did worse—he presented papers calculated to mislead te Legislature to the belief that timings were in a satisfactory state in chl

dna. Granting, however. that Parliament were responsible for the refusal to establish a civil jurisdiction, Government, by the act of 1833, could have established a criminal and Admiralty jurisdiction by an order in Council : but this they had neglected. Sir Robert then addressed himself to the distinct question of the necessity of the war under existing eircumstances,—a question of extreme difficulty. Ile described the Chinese, on the authority of those hest acquainted with them, as mild, moderate, and reasonable, and dis-

And there were other powers : the contest might not be sinjly be- tween England and China— In the course of a conflict with a commercial people, having niations with so many powerful countries in the world, it behoved the Britbdi Government to be prepared for the possible contingency that collisions might arise other than those between England and Chinea.t74,1,1:dmibteaRtthroaidiginlivt It,limtaht CEhnigulatinaduwaothault have to fight the uaiiie or ail th,":

common cause would be made with this country for the purism. of extorting general advantages for them all. But let them not act upon that delusion. They instituted their blockade on the Ilth of September—they withdrew it on the lfith; they instituted it because a boat was missing—thev withdrew it be- cause the boat was found. But no mention was made Of the had that occurred in the interval—that of a protest having been made against the blockade by the American merchants; not one word was said in this despatch of that circum- stance. The protest was presented in the interval to Captain Smith. The Americans told him that the blockade was illegal, and they should hold hint responsible. What influence that might have had he knew not, but he could not help thinking that the protest was more effectual than the recovery cf the boat.

In conclusion— He called on the Government to remember the peculiar character of the people with whom they were about to be in conflict. It had lasted through many generations ; and the character which was given of them by Pliny was the very character which most correctly applied to them at this hour. He sincerely hoped that the result of these operations might It?, after the -.indica- tion of the bonour of England had beets effected, the re;:ftablishment of amicable relations between the two countrie, with as littie disturbance of the friendly feeline that had formerly existed as possible. In the alksence of every confidence in her 3Iajesty's Government, and in the abscoee of every other consolation, he at lea,t would accept that which the piety of the rl',:ht honour- able gentleman the Member for Edinburgh offered. 1k WC 11111 j0:11 that right

honourable gentleman in an earnest prayer to tl:e fl:Toser of

Events, " from whom all good councils and all illSt NrOrk.., a., and

would beg of God that he might dispose the miuds of this people to mercy, and that he would incline them by justice not to dishonour the haraeter of the country, but to act consistently with the vindication of the humour, and at the same time in a manner that might in-mire to tlie.,•1 r. e■meiliation at an early period with those with whom they were about to war. He prayed to God that he would avert from them the calamities of war, and that he would turn away from them those evils which he must s:ly 11:e neglect and incapacity of their rulers had most righteously &served. ((;: cf«criny.)

Lord PALMERSTON now presented himself. He said, that if Sir James Graham's motion and speech had not been so pointedly direeted against the department under lits peculiar care, he should. have really thought it unnecessary to address the House on a motion so b chly conceived and so feebly enforced. He would not er.ter into the delmuils on which the gentlemen opposite had descanted. It svas unztece,SAIy. after the very satisfactory replies given from his side of the House : but there were one or two points to which lie would advert. Mr. Gladstone had asserted the feet that the Chinese had poisoned the wells, and then said it was a mere matter of course.

Mr. GistineroNE—" I corrected the mistake on the instant, and in the noble ViseottnCs hearing ; and I said there was no evidence of the fact of poisoning."

Lord PALMERSTON resumed— his objection was not to the honourable 'Member assuming that the filet was RS he had suggested or not, but that. havinm. assumed it in his ow n mind at the moment, he should have treated it as a mattmr of course—as an art justified ou the part of the ('hinese. its accomplishing time purpose is hit h t y haul in .eiew, namely, the expulsion of persons whom they widied to drive fn an their shores. Ile was wilhimig IC bdiVVV. 111,, hearts from his knowledge of tile character of the honourable gentleman. that he was the last man in the II oils,. who would upon reflection stand up in hi< place to fl, f,1:.1 doetrine so in.mstrons : but Ise regretted that he had not immediatel■ not ,eily given t h:11 e.idanation which. he had now made, but that he did not fairly tate. IN lilt 11:':,t VI,S0d in MS mind at the moment. that he had expressed his opnlion hastily. and that he was far from holding aims- such doctrine as that which he had e.isurdly stated that he entertained :stud he was SIM that in Sa■-ing he NV as only declaring that opinion which the honourable lember himself wonla have stated to the House it' he had fbr one moment considered the views Ns hick he had expressed.

The gravamen of the charge against himself was, that he bad neglected to supply the British Superintendent with prompt aud suffi- cient instructions— Ile had been touch observed upon for rot answerin., the u!,...pateltes which reached I • with sufficient quickness; but, it' so ir,w), pr;ui.< us due to the Duke of Wellinceton for the immediate answers which he g.:1‘ e to letters reach- ing him, and which he sent on the flay after their :irrival. surely he was en- titled to twice as much praise, for he had answered two or more letters within the saint, time as that taken bv the noble duke. k Laugill:r.) Ile held in Isis hand list of ms great numb.Cr of despatches, which, bowel er, he would not posed to friendly intercourse with foreigners. He hoped to God they were not going to war with such a people in a revengeful spirit. He implored Ministers to recollect, that they were going to war with an =warlike people, it was true, but still with three hundred and fifty millions— Was there any one, he would ask, on either side of the House, who would repudiate the sentiment which he uttered? Did they wish to carry on the war in a revengeful spirit ? Did they not, on the contrary, wish when justice should have been exacted, that the foundations for a state of permanent tran- quillity between the two nations should be laid? The Chinese were a people with whom British intercourse was daily increasing; they were a people who had a demand for the commodities which British industry could supply ; and honourable gentlemen might depend upon it, that such was the fatal nature of this contest, that every blow they inflicted on the Chinese must eventually re- coil upon themselves. Such was the condition of this country, that there was not a village they could ravage without at the same time ravaging in a degree some manufacture of their own. He did not underrate the power of this country ; he knew that in every conflict with the Chinese Livland must have the superiority. It was impossible to read the details of the action where the English frigate passed up the line of Chinese junks, and disabled almost every one of them, while the single shot that came from them struck only upon a cask—they could not, in spite of the honourable testimony borne to the gal- lantry of their opponents, read that detail without being convinced that the superiority of the British nation was unquestionable. But let them not on that account conceal from themselves the perilous nature of the conflict into which they were about to enter—a conflict which would be necessarily uncer- tain in its result. The new power which might arise from an weal /mm millions, and the new weapons which national honour and national spirit might furnish them with beyond even the immensity of their own power, gave an mincer- tainty to the issue, and might even make temporary success consistent eventu- ally with the ruin of this country. trouble the House by reading ; but he would state, that if any person would take the trouble to go through them, and compare the dates of the receipt of the despatches and of the sending back answers, he thought that it would be found that what the honourable .Member for Liskeard had said was true—that when any points which did require instructions were stated, the answer was invariably given within such a period as, on a fair consideration of the questions propounded, could be reasonably expected.

He begged to ask those who blamed him, what instructions he ought to have sent ?— Honourable Members opposite said, " It is not fair for you to expect us to tell you : we make the charge, it is for you to repel it." Han accusation of the sin of commission were intended, he granted that the statement of the matters complained of, without any suggestion being thrown out as to what ought to have been done, was alone necessary ; but when the offence alleged was omission, the case was reversed, and the persons who brought forward the accusation were bound to state the grounds on which it was nutde, and to point out what, in their opinion, ought to have been done. (Ministerial cheers.) This had been put to honourable Members opposite, time after time, by honourable friends of his; but they had invariably shrouded themselves under the vague and mysterious terms "precise instructions " and " sufficient powers." '1 hey did not dare to point out what the pavers really were which they thought ought to have been given, but they all knew what they were. The powers which they thought ought to have been given, though not one of them chose to say so, were to expel from Chhin every man who was thought to be engaged in the opium-trade, and to drive away every ship which might be supposed to be employed in the same traffic. The general instructions given to the Super- intendent were the same as those always given to every consular officer appointed to a foreign station. He was instructed to acquire all possible in- formation—to protect all British subjects—to mediate between British sub- jects and the Government of the country.

It was alleged by Sir Robert Peel, that he ought at least to have used the powers given by the act of 1833, and established a criminal and Admiralty jutisdiction : but the papers on the table showed that criminal and Admiralty Court had been established ; and that charge therefore fell to the ground. It was not his fault that Parliament re- fused to sanction the bill he had introduced for the establieleneet af tt

.1.14V aigreeti witn Sir John Hobbousie as to the im- policy of attempting to put down the opium-trade by main force. Ile denied that the Chinese authorities were opposed to it on account of its immorality— Why had they not put down the cultivation of the poppy in Mut ? No, it was a bullion question with them ; mid there was perhaps a poppy agricul- tural interest concerned in excluding, foreign opium. What would Parliament have said if the Goverment had conic down with ft naval estimate for a flotilla to prevent smuggling on the coast of china? What would have been the effect of attempting to do in China what we could not do at home : if, hopeless of keeping out tobacco from Ireland, we sent our cruisers to China, we should have made ourselves the laughingstock of the world ?

. He fully concurred with Sir Robert Peel that the hostile preparations ought not to be pushed whit a vindictive feeling, or to the extent of ravaging and destroying the Chinese territory further than the occa- sion might absolutely- require. With regard to the danger of collision with other countries, and with America especially, lie would say, that while lie had received no copy of the mentorial said to have been ad- dressed to Captain Smith by the American mere-halos against the blockade of (.'entim port, he had received a comimmication front Wash- ington, encloeing a memorial from the Anierican merchants at Canton, soliciting the co6peration of their Government with the British for the purpose of' establishing commercial relations tvith China on a safe and honourable footing, and esi..ecially for obtaining the following con- cessions- - First—Permi,i r ft reign envoys to reside imar tho court of Canton. on the terms aml nOt, al! P.C.,. LI at other ■•ourts, tilts ,1111 whom appeal may

be mole to the ear,s of with the local authorities in

the i.n,sc.eisti.,

„,ii lixti liner or dimes 011 a,lisisa 110111 of import and ex' ,,:t. ft. 41, kit; silks--1 MI any psi tee w.liatever.

'flor - -s-till tPgiiitStIssiis pertniitin4 the

tranship, . ,.s v.:. I ,• i f,.A1,,,tt nos, ti, mat ket its (.■,itia• " Foldth ttit Itotti ii Chitrt Oct. that of Canon'. "n 0:12 ■•■••• t•tt pmsoe '-I time %sli missile or the ■1:1 • :;,••••■! 0••1-1,;••7. -,••1;•• :1111t 111,1,••:-tY With a tot iteetce ;he r „;• o1,, sicurie.• Isi• tie- use egress 1'10111 • : I .t'I (1:itie or i.11:11 at any :led at altt.rtt ' • .

" ,. • ft,. 1:: • ,',i,tiac•ly tIUsti intl I.:•',,11'1.00.41117.1.(1,111e • ! . ■ L LI t'.,- not bc a,U. , ;: , ;!, • • .. ;•:. . t. i• I '-its I Slates or .; ■,• : •Ut I • tt I•hiv., 1o1 .1•e.; Nam any foreLnor 1,1;1.11: lie ',LL,•I; fairly ." Ti-• 1111?1:: 1IL ;1- -.1 1!1:1t die pill I Ity utt•Ci,Ht,e theI ".-' ' -"':" "'" It' ""'"' I "Itti I sent—an extraordinary nuasure like the present— ought to be adopted.

trout (••; c • H... :out to, "I, ■in place the in the. case of Stoekdale and I lansa'rtl, commenting upon them as he with • ; = • A:■•e: ieau tint Ii,t• Alu, what hod privaitcd for at ;least two CCIIItiries past, tic must tali,: the lile•rty to A..P. , ,hew the cpiiiion of British itierchants on the questicm, lie ticultir pulihe purpose, or as atoll:cable or necessery for the discharge of any • wou:•I r ..,1 a letter which lied received the signatures of thirty re- flit:ruction iii 11 Sed h3 the CeliStit tition on the 'liaise of Comimms ; and it there- spe,st;,..:• ::..;.-. in London,— e appc,iCid'Io Iiiin, that the only mode in which (hie resolution "could be made II I. • ■ •-• to .•,‘ et.," e•e. ;, ;;:. ;,,, . el .',; .ay ;I 1i; :.•,a ont ;ieldel to only true ground and principle on which, in his view, such a hill as the pre- ,p.,ii chis, bbs,,i-fust, obtain. Lord 1)eriman then traced Ow oriein. and progress of the proceedings • : stTidied suites went ftion/g lie differed with the I.ord e ellor as to the practice

.• er• ,1 .\ lio•oem diet rioem, cmton, of the I louse of Commons regard to publications-

r•e..:•:.e,i • c •re iefeid or te,hie ;0.. Canton, When the noble and learned lord stated there was nothing 'tow sought but with • ; = • A:■•e: ieau tint Ii,t• Alu, what hod privaitcd for at ;least two CCIIItiries past, tic must tali,: the lile•rty to for the Fey thet what IreS liOW th/lIC was entirely novel and unprecedented. The re- •• ;., 1•5•■•li•lai ,l.••:• kIII! SOILiti(In it ii, t1together it general resolution. There was no limitation of its A..P. , ,hew the cpiiiion of British itierchants on the questicm, lie ticultir pulihe purpose, or as atoll:cable or necessery for the discharge of any • wou:•I r ..,1 a letter which lied received the signatures of thirty re- flit:ruction iii 11 Sed h3 the CeliStit tition on the 'liaise of Comimms ; and it there- spe,st;,..:• ::..;.-. in London,— e appc,iCid'Io Iiiin, that the only mode in which (hie resolution "could be made

a justiticetion and defence in it ease 1-f one inan's libelling his neighleair, was

- London, Oili April 1840. by the lions(' of Commons la) hug it down that they had the pont i• to call by " To Tufa l'i-,-.'17NT l'Ar.lt:ItSTON. " ,,I: I' 1 ,w . I', , , .,. I ,....mod Bp ills'u tneo.11'oes cf,tpueet..,1 ■, ith China, elonnt ti!„1,einini:thpitsc.incvif ptivilege whatever they elms,- to call by that name ; and this stiengt !wool by the prelimiliary discussion in 1 he Hour‘c of COID- -'.- '''' 'I'll' a'ul ' l‘P".1"'si`Hi II"- l'n'hal'ie `.q.'-'t "III' exl''''"-''" nions, lie liMI, on the part of' the .1 sullen. thought it his duiy to the l'aiglish

13riggs, Thurburn, Acramati, and Co., Alexander Matheson, Gledstanes. Kerr. and Co.. James W. Smith,

Alexander George Milne and Co., Watkinshaw. Skinner. null Co ,

Colgulienu, and Cu., Magnin. Smiths, and Co.,

Julm S Rigge, of the tirm of Sanderson, Dallas and Cotes, Frys, Fox, and Co., William Drayner, U. H. Lindsay, Hunter, Gouger, and. Co., Gregson and Co., C. S. Gover,

Daniel Dickinson and Cu., Robert Eglintun mud Co., Crawford. Colvin, and Co., Scott, 11,11, and Cu.,

Larkins and Cu., John Brightman,

Lyall Brothers and Co., C. It. Bead and Co."

[ Loud cheering was elicited bg the reading of this document.] Lord Palmerston -professed still to hope that actual hostilities might be prevented by the submission of the Emperor of China, and amicable relations restored without the effusion of blood.

Sir JAMES GRAHAM commenced a reply ; but the House was too im- patient, and the division took place—

or the motion Against it Majority for the Opium War 10 The House adjourned at half-past four in the morning.

CLERGy. RESERVES.

The Lords were chiefly occupied on Tuesday with the discussion of

a motion by the Bishop of EXETER, that four questions should be put to the Judges as to the construction of the act of Parliament which allotted the " Reserves"' in Canada to the " Protestant clergy." The main points at issue were, whether the term " Protestant clergy " did not, mean the Church of England clergy exclusively ; whether it did not iuclude the clergy of the Church of Scotland ; further, whether it did not include Protestant ministers of all denominations. The Bishop of LONDON and the Bishop of Exteren argued that the clergy of' the Church of England alone had a right to the reserves. The Earl of liennueerrox advocated the claims ef ;11-z olergy of the Church of Scots- i.LOrti 1.-V-1.ELBOURNE maintained that the Protestant clergy

ia- eluded Protestant ministers of all denominatious. Lord ammo-- nouon was quite convinced of the utter hopelessness of attempting to maintain the predominance of the Church of England in the Colonies, and regretted that the Bishop of Exeter had stirred the question. The Duke of WELLINGTON was for consulting the Judges.

The House, by a vote of 57 to 40, agreed that the two first questions, embracing the pith of the motion, should be put to the Judges.

PRIVILEGE.

Lord Chancellor COTTENIIAM moved the second reading of the Printed Papers Bill, on Monday. lie explained that the measure did not in any respect curtail or enlarge Parliamentary privilege, but merely provided for the more convenient exercise of the powers pos- sessed by both Houses. The House of Commons had -exercised the right of publishing its proceedings for two centuries. The order of 1835, authorizing the sale of' Parliamentary papers, made no difference in the legal question. In point of fact, the circulation of Parliamentary papers had rather fallen off than increased since that order was made. The right of publication not being disputed, but the exercise of that right being attended with inconvenience, it was obviously expedient to introduce a measure of the character he now offered to the Lords. He asked no more Ibr Parliament than was conceded to tribunals of hifi- nitcly less dignity and less entitled to public eonfidenee than either House of' Paritanient. The bill assumed the accuracy of' the law as laid down by the Court of Queen's Bench, that the production of the authority of Parliament for any publication did not protect the pub- lisher or any agent of Parliament from legal proceedings. The bill would give that protection, and enable the House of Commons to do without difficulty what they had been in the habit of doing for at least two centuries.

Lord Dexmex said, be was anxious to take the earliest opportunity of expeessing his opinion that the House would best cmisidt the public interest by acceding to the Lord Chancellor's motion— It 'MIS MOSt dCSiTable that the present painful state of things on this subject

should Le put an end to as soon ,irs; possible. It was quite impossible for any thing to have been brought halyard in it more moderate, a more conciliatory

toile, than had been exhibited by his noble and learned friend. t the same time, he felt that the discussions, mid the tone and nature of those discussions which for the last fhtir months had OCCUpiell the public mind, made it neces- sary for him to oiler a line observations on the state this case, for the pur- pose of removing misconception which had generally prevailed ; to rescue per- sons who had done but theqr ditty hum undeserved censure ; and to state the

...•••••

261 271

I " reference to anv particular case ; it was not set forth as applying to any par- : It•lwitt ti, tittli mittitry a Ow •' , ,r't , • 1,„ gdmit ii sate us pu-i ruble,tool would not give it the Dome ot law. He might perhaps have expressed lids too wartnly, mid too largely somewhat ; but that his doctrine seas right, be was persuaded to ilea moment ; and lie felt (I at if be bad thrown a doubt by dclay on a proposition of this importance, so clear in itself; be should have been betraying the duty he had placed in his hands to discharge. lo frame theSe resolutions, a Committee of the House of' (2onunons was appointed, who made a length). report on the subject, in which they gave all the authori- ties on the question, hum silt historical and legal, ere they came to this resolution. First ste.thig the necessity of publication, they went on—. '1.1iat by the law and privilege of Parliament, this Illouse Ints the sole and exclusive jurisdiction to determine upon the existence and extent of its 'privileges ; and that the instittl- tiou or prosecution of any action, suit, or other proceeding, for the purpose of b000ng them into discussion or decision before any court or tribunal elsewhere than ill Parliament, is a high breach of such privilege, and renders all parties coonesemed therein amenable to its just displeasure, and to the punishment ne quent thereon. That for any court or tribunal to assume to decide upon matters of privilege inconsistent with the determination of either House of Parliament thereo' n is contrary to the law of Parliament, told is a breach and contempt of the privileges of Parliament." So that the justification for pub- lishing this particular document was simply this—we must have the right to sell all we print, because we have a right to do all we please. Now he took it that this was not the law of England; and he wished most sincerely that when these gentlemen, who, he was sure, felt the strongest conviction of the truth of what they stated, had set forth the matter in the manner in which they had done in thew extensive report, he wished they had refrained from using words ofthrentenienand menace towards the tribunals of the country; which could not have the 'slightest effect on the decisions to which these courts would come, Bed which most certainly the House of Commons would themselves deplore were it to produce such an effect, or induce the Judges to form an opinion in the slightest degree different from what judgment und their conscience told them was true and right.

He referred to the contests which at different periods of English his- tory had occurred between the Courts of Law and the House of Coro- mons; arguing that not only were the Courts in the right, but that popular feeling went along with them in resisting the arbitrary exercise of privilege-

•

On one occasioo a petition was presented from the Grand Jury and free- holders of the county. of Kent, calling upon the lloti,e Of Commons to give more aid to the Sovereign for a war against France. The language of the pe- tition was perhaps semewhat strong, but not at all stronger than what was heard every day now; and for this petition, suggesting in what mode the go-

vernment Aould be conducted, the genCemen representing the Grand duty and

freeholders of the important county of Kent were sent by the House of Com- mons to prism', where they remained till the close of the session. Upon this occasion, De Foe, the most popular of all writers, and Lord Somers, the great advocate of liberty, both wrote in derided terms against the condoct of the House of Commons in imprisoning three gentlemen, and in favour of the right of the people to petition. One of the main grounds on which this MI-

limited power or the House of Comm se

ons was based by its pporters, was, that it was necessary ssary that ourse should have the power of contending against the Crown, and preventing the prerogative from being itijurious to the people. But 'appose that prerogative and privilege should happen to coalesce—that the Douse of Commons should aid the Crown in contending agtinst popular rights ; this had been the case more than once ; it was the case during the whole of the latter half of the eighteenth century, when the popular parts. in this e0Illary were constantly contending against such an &liana.. Both Lord Chatham and the great popular writer of -that day. Junius, spoke strongly in repudiation of the privileges which the House of Commons now said were so necessary to enable them to assert popular rights against the Crown. The sort of thletrine now insisted on in the other House, thougn so often asserted, had not been acted on.

He denied that the privilege of unlimited publication was necessary to enable the lions,: of Commons to discharge its proper functions— He hail eihkavottred to understand %shy the House of Commons should have this privilege—what were the functioes which requir, it. But it appeared to him that the reasons ossigned did not bear out the propo• sition for a moment. Tit° House of Commons said they must satisfy the people as to the grounds on which they passed laws. But was it to be said that any law was to be passed on ex parte statements injurious to indi- viduals who had no opportunity to defend themselves? Were such the grounds for legislation ? Was it necessary to sound lawmaking that individuals should be subjected to the penalty of beino. slandered in publications cimulated by the House of Commons, and against which they were to have no remedy ? N 'ere 31embers of the House of Commons to justify themselves to their con- stituents by the dissemination of private slander? No doubt it was the duty of the House of Commons, and a most important duty, to inquire into abuses and delinquencies; and, no doubt, this inquiry must take place in order to im- peach, remove, and censure, for all such purposes : but lie would ask, was this duty to he performed by the premature circulation of evidence taken ca. parte ? or Nees it not rather confermahle to the practice of the Euglish law, that such ham:ries should ba secret, and be brought forward against a man until he has notice of the cliar;;e which he bad to answer It We, d that one of the funerii0iS of the of Commons was to deliberate, if ilecessary, tile ex- clusion of an heir epparent to the Crown : but it the case arose, could it be said t hat this function had to be performed by the process of Pulsating the public mind by thlse staternentS, which the individuel lied no oppm tnuity of controverting WilS DaUgelidde$ example to he held up as a pro:idea for Path:tuna to fellow, who, in the case of' Charles the Second. lb fore the Boats of Commons a mass of infamons falsehoods against iudividuals. which the House of Commons printed and circulated throughout the country ?

He would not trouble the House with remarks on the proceedings against Stockdale or Howard, but he must say a few words on the ease of the Sheriffs— The Sheriffs had received the plaintiffs' money, and thee were bound by law to deliver it over. They were as much the trustees of die plaintiff as any of the bailiffs employed on their Lordships' estates. They might be compelled to pay it over. The Court had no right to decline to at them if they refused to do So, or if they appeared desirous to obey the House of Commons turd re- tain it ; and vet, fir hating &tie that act, tor the in gloct which they would hare becn lirible to heavy penalticir, they had Imen ii: id to undergo a punish went more severe than that awarded to tinny 61011 convietS iii tiliS country.

lie thought that in this state of things, and when 5.ftockdale was mul-

tipls ing his me iii its all the counties of England, it was right, for the

benefit of ell part its, that Parliament should in and that the Lords should enable the Commons to publish their proceedings, under Certain restrictiotts-

lle thought that when the House of' Commons came to ask the assistance of the llottse of Lords in passing a bill to make such publicatiens as be had re- ferred to legal, it o effect en undertaking on the part of the House of Commons that they N1 011111 eXO eke a discretion in every smelt ease of pultlica • tion, and that they would take care that no pain should be indicted or injury done Sit tire incliiiltutls ; or at any rate, if any injury were inflicted, that the eases in which such an injury was done should bear so smith a proportion to the general number of eases, that no objection could be made to the privilege in general.

Ile had some objection to the machinery of the bill, and suggested alterations to he made in Committee. Ile also thought that the bill ought to go further— He thought that every newspaper publisher and every bookseller became for this purpose the officer of the House; and he could not cotweive whet oh jection there could he in point of principle to the extension of the protection to these individuals. If, for instance, there were extracts published from a l'ellort plain:Shed under the authority of the House of Commons, he should. :my that there could be no objection to leaving it to a Jury to say whether the ex- tracts were made bond fide or not ; and if the publication was clearly not ma- licious, then the Jury might be directed to tind a verdict for the defendant. There was another point which Inc could not help mentioning, and it was this: it struck him that it would he a most important improvement in the bill, if, whenever the plaintiff in a cafe of libel had failed on account of a justification pleaded and established, it were provided that be should never have the right to proceed ogainst any other individual for the same libel, but that the defence established in the one case should be a bar to all other actions.

Lord MELBOURNE supported the claim of the House of Commons to the privilege of unlimited publication, on the ground of its being essen- tial to the discharge of their functions ; and maintained, that in the recent proceedings for the enforcement of the privilege, the Commons had only done their duty, and were of necessity driven to harsh mea- sures— The House of Commons possessed no other means of enforcing their privi- leges ; and it was admitted that these means were inadequate to their object. Mr. Burke had pointed this out long ago, and told the House that they had nothing but a Sergeant-at-Arms with his mace, and that they possessed no powers if an executive character. Still it was necessary, in his opinion, that these privileg,es should Incsupported and maintained ; but at the same time, it was most desirable that the pm.ent state of things Aould Fe put an coil to; and he hoped, therefirre, that their Lordships would go into Committee, in order that a final remedy might be thund for the dangers which it presented.

The Duke of WELLINGTON dwelt upon the mischief which might arise from the authorized publication and sale of libels upon foreigners, and especially upon foreign potentates. Ile attributed the difficulties which had occurred mainly to the resolution of 1S35 which allowed the sale of papers, and hoped that in Committee some provision would be introduced into the bill to restore the limitation as to sale which ex- isted under the common law before 1535.

The Marquis of' Morn bad strong objections to the manner in which Committees of the House of Commons frsquently conducted their in

t.oe cattle! take up the volumes of Evidence printed by the two Houses or Parliament iii him. seeing that the !louse of' Lords Iva, much more nUtiOUS thiai the lioto, of Commons in striking wit the names of parties who were likely to be injured by the publication of their inquiries. What had rendered the liaise M Cornmons so of late years, it not fin' him to say, but the matter was most glaring ; amid ulna rendered it most offensive was, the name of the Member risking the ohnoxicrus questions was now invariably printed. When he saw honourable Members calliog before them pieties Wring high judicial btations, and compelling them to answer questions which must injure individuals, he must confess that Ile thought no privilege of Parlia- ment ought to shelter those who put such questions. He thought that they ought to he liable to actions iii a court of law.

Bill read a second time. 3lisesmoAse EOUS.

THE ECCLESIASTICAL DUTIES AND REVENUES RILL was read a second time in the House of Commons on Monday, by a majority of 87 to 11. The 'measure was supported by Lord JOHN RUSSELL, Sir ROBERT PEEL, Mn'. LAMEToN, Mr. G. N'EnNoN. Mr. BAINES, and Mr. GOULBURN, and opposed by Sir ROBERT lsoms and Mr. LAW. Sir WILLIAM FOLLETT, Lord TisioNstoont, and Mr. GLADSTONE wished for postponement, that time might be allowed to consider the suggestions of the Deans and Chapters with reference to the bill.

Ttrrsos AND CAMBRIDGE ELECTIONS, On Tuesday, the following were sworn in as a Committee on the Tomes eleetion petition—Mr. Robert Clive (Chairman), Lord Mahon, Mr. East, Mr. Langdale. Mr. 0. ii. Phillips, Mr. Tuffnell, and Captain Jones. On Friday, the fol- lowing took the oaths as members of the Cambridge Election Com- mittee—Sir Charles Lemon (Chairman). Mr. Divett, Sir Jehu Walsh, Mr. Compton, the Earl of Darlingtou, Sir William Somerville, and Mr. Protheroe.

Nens. ZEALAND. On the motion of Lord JOHN RUSSELL, OD Wed- nesday pap( m's relating to New Zealand, and including a correspondence with the Secretary of State, were ordered to be laid on the table.

Lux-rex I.Err000s ox ASTRONOMY. On Thursday, Mr. THOMAS DUNCoMDE presented a petition from 1.4Ott persons who complained of the Lord Chamberlain's refusol to allow Mr. Howell to give lee:tires on astronomy at time Operahustf,e in Passion-week. Mr. Duncombe said that the Lord Chamberbtin had been mu. plied to. but he would neither rescind his orcl..r 1:or '‘:ice a reaS011 for it, l'Inier these circumstances, he moved tin :mliIress to the Queen, praying her 3Iojesty to direct Lord Uxbridge to withdraw his prohibition. Tho motion was seconded by Mr. Iltssus ; feebly opposed by Mr. Fox Maws ; and carried, by 73 to -19.